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posted by Michael Oliver  on April 24, 2018, 3:05 p.m. (7 months, 23 days ago)
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Reviving an old topic. Curious what people are currently using for 4k playback/review systems on hardware and software front.
Seems like lots of evos in an icydock, RV / Resolve / Nuke studio / Scratch / Baselight, Blackmagic / AJA, and 10Gb has been the standard for a while now.
Anyone using zfs on blackback machines to take advantage of tiering or are you just using raid cards with a bunch of ssd?
Seems like this space has been stagnant w/ regards to innovation. I am hoping for something new to play with.
Years ago Daryl Strauss had the Framethrower which provided a pretty good boot to review interface. I suppose I could script something to launch RV in a "console mode" on boot but wanted to see if there were any other solutions out there to:
- provide a controlled environment for review / playback of 4k HDR material with minimal ability for users to change settings and muck things up- HDR, 4:4:4 color accurate playback- Allow material to be remotely primed to fast local storage for instant review- Bonus for allowing direct feedback during the review back into an asset management system (I know RV has this)
Anything new / turnkey / OSS out there that has not hit my radar?
--
Michael Oliver
mcoliver@gmail.com

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Response from Jason Scott @ April 26, 2018, 8:38 a.m.

We do use local storage, but also having a lot of success in reviewing DWB-compressed EXRs, so we can actually play over 10Gb over NFS at 3k (still doing some 4k tests).


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Response from Christian Perschky @ April 26, 2018, 3:40 a.m.

We're using a central server with an SSD raid that caches selected areas of our production storage using GPFS AFM. The playback workstations are directly connected to the server via Mellanox 56Gb/s IB (running @ 40Gb/s eth for now but can be changed.) We also have one newer "test case" playback station that uses the Dell version of the quad port PCIe x16 NVMe board (as do all of our recent workstations) and that has silly-fast I/O. PCIe connected storage is just the way to go for everything where it isn't cost prohibitive.

The biggest issue we've had with using local storage is how you get the relevant data onto it and keep that up to date when the client comes in and wants to see random version of shot from some point in the past. Using the GPFS AFM cache (mostly) works but you don't want to pay for a server license for every single review client. We've had automated processes syncing data onto the local storage in the past but it isn't as elegant as a cache that just pulls it in on demand and keeps the data there until it expires. Any reliable open source version of this using local NVMe storage would be my preference.

ChrisP


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Response from Michael Oliver @ April 25, 2018, 6 p.m.
Thanks everyone. JF/Doug good shoutout on those quad NVMe cards. Very slick form factor and insane throughput.
On Wed, Apr 25, 2018 at 5:46 AM, Todd Smith <todd@sohovfx.com> wrote:
The one thing I wish Scratch did better was annotate and save frames. Beyond that it's been a rock. Definitely a deep learning curve on navigating and understand the layout/flow of the application.
Todd Smith
Head of Information Technology
soho vfx|40 HannaAve. Suite 403, Toronto, Ontario M6K0C3
office:(416) 516-7863fax:(416) 516-9682web:sohovfx.com
----- On Apr 24, 2018, at 8:29 PM, Antoine Durr <antoinedurr@gmail.com> wrote:
The trick is to have local storage. 10Gig wont cut it. We play back 4K DPXes from a pair of 16-bay spindle drive RAIDs just fine, and have also done it from a small RAID of SSDs. While RV has a good pulse of the tools needed around review sessions, and maybe it has improved since I last used it, but for the life of me I cant get it to play anything unless it caches it in RAM, which means for anything thats big, forget it. In that aspect, Scratch (and I presume Resolve) are much more adept at realtime playback from disk. Resolve definitely has a groove going, but just loading it takes 30+ seconds, whereas Scratch takes about 3 seconds to load. The UI takes some getting used to. But with some scripting, you can have your playlist all ready to go in Scratch before you ever open Scratch.
I would not describe Scratch as user proof its a DI tool, not a screening tool. But it does all the other things in your list pretty well.
Antoine



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--
Michael Oliver
mcoliver@gmail.com

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Response from Todd Smith @ April 25, 2018, 8:50 a.m.
The one thing I wish Scratch did better was annotate and save frames.  Beyond that it's been a rock.  Definitely a deep learning curve on navigating and understand the layout/flow of the application.
Todd Smith
Head of Information Technology
soho vfx | 40 Hanna Ave. Suite 403, Toronto, Ontario M6K 0C3
office: (416) 516-7863 fax: (416) 516-9682 web: sohovfx.com
----- On Apr 24, 2018, at 8:29 PM, Antoine Durr <antoinedurr@gmail.com> wrote:
The trick is to have local storage.  10Gig wont cut it.  We play back 4K DPXes from a pair of 16-bay spindle drive RAIDs just fine, and have also done it from a small RAID of SSDs.    While RV has a good pulse of the tools needed around review sessions, and maybe it has improved since I last used it, but for the life of me I cant get it to play anything unless it caches it in RAM, which means for anything thats big, forget it.   In that aspect, Scratch (and I presume Resolve) are much more adept at realtime playback from disk.  Resolve definitely has a groove going, but just loading it takes 30+ seconds, whereas Scratch takes about 3 seconds to load.  The UI takes some getting used to.  But with some scripting, you can have your playlist all ready to go in Scratch before you ever open Scratch.
I would not describe Scratch as user proof its a DI tool, not a screening tool.   But it does all the other things in your list pretty well.
Antoine



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Response from Doug Meyer @ April 24, 2018, 11:05 p.m.
For local storage were using the Asus 4x m.2 card with 2TB 960 Pros.  8TB in an x16 slot for $5k and itll read around 13 GB/s.  



On Apr 24, 2018, at 8:29 PM, Antoine Durr <antoinedurr@gmail.com> wrote:

The trick is to have local storage.  10Gig wont cut it.  We play back 4K DPXes from a pair of 16-bay spindle drive RAIDs just fine, and have also done it from a small RAID of SSDs.    While RV has a good pulse of the tools needed around review sessions, and maybe it has improved since I last used it, but for the life of me I cant get it to play anything unless it caches it in RAM, which means for anything thats big, forget it.   In that aspect, Scratch (and I presume Resolve) are much more adept at realtime playback from disk.  Resolve definitely has a groove going, but just loading it takes 30+ seconds, whereas Scratch takes about 3 seconds to load.  The UI takes some getting used to.  But with some scripting, you can have your playlist all ready to go in Scratch before you ever open Scratch.
I would not describe Scratch as user proof its a DI tool, not a screening tool.   But it does all the other things in your list pretty well.
Antoine


On Apr 24, 2018, at 12:00 PM, Michael Oliver <mcoliver@gmail.com> wrote:
Reviving an old topic.  Curious what people are currently using for 4k playback/review systems on hardware and software front.  
Seems like lots of evos in an icydock, RV / Resolve / Nuke studio / Scratch / Baselight, Blackmagic / AJA, and 10Gb has been the standard for a while now.   
Anyone using zfs on blackback machines to take advantage of tiering or are you just using raid cards with a bunch of ssd?
Seems like this space has been stagnant w/ regards to innovation.  I am hoping for something new to play with.
Years ago Daryl Strauss had the Framethrower which provided a pretty good boot to review interface.  I suppose I could script something to launch RV in a "console mode" on boot but wanted to see if there were any other solutions out there to:
- provide a controlled environment for review / playback of 4k HDR material with minimal ability for users to change settings and muck things up- HDR, 4:4:4 color accurate playback- Allow material to be remotely primed to fast local storage for instant review- Bonus for allowing direct feedback during the review back into an asset management system (I know RV has this)
Anything new / turnkey / OSS out there that has not hit my radar?
--
Michael Oliver
mcoliver@gmail.com
To unsubscribe from the list send a blank e-mail to mailto:studiosysadmins-discuss-request@studiosysadmins.com?subject=unsubscribe

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Response from Anonymous @ April 24, 2018, 8:30 p.m.
The trick is to have local storage.  10Gig wont cut it.  We play back 4K DPXes from a pair of 16-bay spindle drive RAIDs just fine, and have also done it from a small RAID of SSDs.    While RV has a good pulse of the tools needed around review sessions, and maybe it has improved since I last used it, but for the life of me I cant get it to play anything unless it caches it in RAM, which means for anything thats big, forget it.   In that aspect, Scratch (and I presume Resolve) are much more adept at realtime playback from disk.  Resolve definitely has a groove going, but just loading it takes 30+ seconds, whereas Scratch takes about 3 seconds to load.  The UI takes some getting used to.  But with some scripting, you can have your playlist all ready to go in Scratch before you ever open Scratch.
I would not describe Scratch as user proof its a DI tool, not a screening tool.   But it does all the other things in your list pretty well.
Antoine


On Apr 24, 2018, at 12:00 PM, Michael Oliver <mcoliver@gmail.com> wrote:
Reviving an old topic.  Curious what people are currently using for 4k playback/review systems on hardware and software front.  
Seems like lots of evos in an icydock, RV / Resolve / Nuke studio / Scratch / Baselight, Blackmagic / AJA, and 10Gb has been the standard for a while now.   
Anyone using zfs on blackback machines to take advantage of tiering or are you just using raid cards with a bunch of ssd?
Seems like this space has been stagnant w/ regards to innovation.  I am hoping for something new to play with.
Years ago Daryl Strauss had the Framethrower which provided a pretty good boot to review interface.  I suppose I could script something to launch RV in a "console mode" on boot but wanted to see if there were any other solutions out there to:
- provide a controlled environment for review / playback of 4k HDR material with minimal ability for users to change settings and muck things up- HDR, 4:4:4 color accurate playback- Allow material to be remotely primed to fast local storage for instant review- Bonus for allowing direct feedback during the review back into an asset management system (I know RV has this)
Anything new / turnkey / OSS out there that has not hit my radar?
--
Michael Oliver
mcoliver@gmail.com
To unsubscribe from the list send a blank e-mail to mailto:studiosysadmins-discuss-request@studiosysadmins.com?subject=unsubscribe


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Response from Jean-Francois Panisset @ April 24, 2018, 7:05 p.m.
RV does seem to be the canonical solution, OSS apps rarely seem to know how to talk to a "video card" (would love to be proven wrong). The nascent Python API in Resolve 15 does seem to open some interesting possibilities, especially given how aggressive Resolve is at supporting the latest codec du jour. Saw this thing at NAB: http://www.highpoint-tech.com/USA_new/series-ssd7101a-overview.htm Stick 4 x Samsung 960 NVMe M.2 gumsticks in there and you have more GB/sec than you'll ever need (famous last words). Fewer moving parts and more performance than IcyDock + EVOs + SATA cables, unless you really need a lot of local cache. JF On Tue, Apr 24, 2018 at 12:00 PM, Michael Oliver wrote: > Reviving an old topic. Curious what people are currently using for 4k > playback/review systems on hardware and software front. > > Seems like lots of evos in an icydock, RV / Resolve / Nuke studio / Scratch > / Baselight, Blackmagic / AJA, and 10Gb has been the standard for a while > now. > > Anyone using zfs on blackback machines to take advantage of tiering or are > you just using raid cards with a bunch of ssd? > > Seems like this space has been stagnant w/ regards to innovation. I am > hoping for something new to play with. > > Years ago Daryl Strauss had the Framethrower which provided a pretty good > boot to review interface. I suppose I could script something to launch RV > in a "console mode" on boot but wanted to see if there were any other > solutions out there to: > > - provide a controlled environment for review / playback of 4k HDR material > with minimal ability for users to change settings and muck things up > - HDR, 4:4:4 color accurate playback > - Allow material to be remotely primed to fast local storage for instant > review > - Bonus for allowing direct feedback during the review back into an asset > management system (I know RV has this) > > Anything new / turnkey / OSS out there that has not hit my radar? > > -- > Michael Oliver > mcoliver@gmail.com > > > To unsubscribe from the list send a blank e-mail to > mailto:studiosysadmins-discuss-request@studiosysadmins.com?subject=unsubscribe To unsubscribe from the list send a blank e-mail to mailto:studiosysadmins-discuss-request@studiosysadmins.com?subject=unsubscribe

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